Curse

Galatea · May 02, 2005, 03:20 PM // 15:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Garric

Whats so illegal about this? Nothing.

I believe it's against the EULA, not only in Guild Wars, but generally in other games, as well:

Quote:

1. TERMS OF AGREEMENT

(a) Terms of Agreement. NC Interactive, Inc. and ArenaNet Inc. (collectively, “NC Interactive”) offer to allow you to play its multi-player online computer game “Guild Wars” conditioned on your agreement to all of the terms and conditions contained in this Agreement and your compliance with the posted Rules of Conduct.

*snip snip*

3. LICENSE TO USE

Subject to the terms of this Agreement, NC Interactive grants to you, for your personal use only, a non-exclusive, revocable, nontransferable (except as permitted in Section 4(a)) license to use the Service, and a non-exclusive, revocable, nontransferable (except as permitted in Section 4(a)) license to use the Software in connection with the Service, without charge except for new Chapters which will be charged on a prepaid basis according to Section 5.

You may not (a) sublicense, rent, lease, loan or otherwise transfer the Software or the Service (or any part thereof), including without limitation access keys; (b) modify, adapt, reverse engineer or decompile the Software, or otherwise attempt to derive source code from the Software; (c) create any derivative works in respect of the Software or the Service; or (d) otherwise use the Software or the Service except as expressly provided in this Agreement. You should keep your access key in a safe place and not share it with anyone else. The access key can be used only once. Title to the Software, and all rights with respect to the Software and Service not specifically granted under this Agreement, including without limitation all rights of reproduction, modification, distribution, display, disassembly and decompilation and all copyright, patent, trademark, trade secret and other proprietary rights and interests are reserved to NC Interactive.

*snip snip*

4. ACCOUNT

(c) Rights to Use Accounts. By agreeing to the User Agreement you agree that you do not own either the Master Account or Game Account (collectively, the “Account”) you use to access the service, the characters created on the Account and that NC Interactive stores on NC Interactive servers, the items stored on these servers, or any other data from which the servers and accounts are comprised. The Account you create is needed to login to the service as per section 4(b) and the fee that you pay is to access new Chapters.

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6. CONTENT AND MEMBER CONDUCT

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Garric

It doesn't ruin your experience.

It doesn't wreck the econ.

Get over it.

Actually, if this kind of thing continues, it, over time, will ruin the experience for many & wreck the econ. Take FFXI: Online, for example. People started spending their time farming for items that were worth a lot in game. Let's say, a weapon that cost 10K gil. Eventually, gil started being sold online, and players began to see prices in the Auction House fluctuate more often, and inflation began to occur. I've quit the game, so I can't see the actual prices, but I've been told that the gil-selling situation has made the game quite unbearable. Now, for $30 USD, you can purchase 1 million gil. For roughly $100, you can purchase 4 million gil. The rare items that used to cost only 10-20K or so now are priced in the millions. That kind of in-game money is hard to come by from regular playing (I would know, since it took me a long time just to raise 50K or so the honest way for armor). It's gotten to the point where you either just suck it up and not use the cool items, or you have to spend your real hard-earned cash for virtual items.

And as for ruining the experience, it's frowned upon by many.

TwinRaven · May 02, 2005, 04:26 PM // 16:26

http://search.iwon.com/commerce/cach...video+game&st=

Read this and tell me selling in game items for real cash is harmless. O.K. admittedly, it's an extreme case...it's just wrong...morally, ethically, legally, economically...sellng in game items is sleazy and arguably illigal.

kaycha · May 02, 2005, 04:42 PM // 16:42

QUOTE:

He cannot do anything the person he bought the virtual gold from couldn't do. Player to player transactions do not add or remove anything from the game.

Deagol

I agree that sigular individuals selling items and gold (my hypothetical scenario was somewhat flawed) do not have too large an effect on the economy; however, the way the FFXI (so Ive heard) and the Diablo economy were ruined was because of botting or large gold "farms" that some stores ran. In those farms, hundreds of people were employed to farm gold 24/7. You cannot expect a casual player to earn enough money to compete with these farmers, which forces them to either grind for gold 24/7 as well or buy gold from the farms.

- Kcha

Rizzen Khalazar · May 02, 2005, 05:22 PM // 17:22

You cant stop this, you cant even slow it down. It will be a part of gaming wether we like it or not. If it does not affect you, then dont worry about it. If people want to spend RL money for game items, oh well.

Deagol · May 02, 2005, 05:29 PM // 17:29

Farm bots will hurt more than the in-game economy. They will hurt ArenaNet financially because they will put a constant load on the servers. Which will hurt us, cause there will be less money to develop new content for.

Rizzen Khalazar · May 02, 2005, 05:43 PM // 17:43

Hopefully with their streaming technology they can catch bots and just ban em on the spot.

NiknudStunod · May 02, 2005, 07:41 PM // 19:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Garric

The only reason companies try to shut this down is because they wish they could sell items but they can't, so they dislike people selling something they can't sell and getting money for it. Let me give you an analogy:

A guy has a farm, for $50 you can go in and pick your own berries for as long as you want. Now, you can't then just start going outside of your farm and start selling your berries, because that wouldn't make sense. Yet some people will pick their berries, go outside, and sell them to others. Would you be mad if someone did that?

But in the end, there's nothing wrong with doing this. The whole world is pretty much capitalistic, so anything goes in business. People need to calm down and stop saying that this is wrong because it ruins the game, it doesn't. You are just jealous that one person can get an item that you would have to spend 20 hours for in a few minutes by spending cash. Sure, you could do that, but I find it more rewarding to find it the item myself.

The reason people spend money for items on other games is most said items are gamebreakers. When the devs created this game they eliminated the need for selling items and money because even great items are only slightly better then normal items. The level limit being 20 and the fact you don't need 80 man raid groups to do the high level instances will also help eliminate this because everyone and anyone can get good loot drops. In fact I have joined random groups and had people give me weapons they got from a mission or quest before I joined. That was how I got my first purple weapon.

Devil's Dictionary · May 05, 2005, 02:06 AM // 02:06

I don't see the problem in this. It's not like the money is hacked. It's aquired in the gameworld and hence is legal. If 10 platinum changes hands, it doesn't affect the ammount of money in the game.

Kingofblades · May 05, 2005, 07:00 AM // 07:00

15-23 Damage sword? Swords only go to 22.. Check the pvp characters. Unless you are saying they giving pve characters an advantage for no reason? Go into the game and hit print screen then upload it to image shack or stop lying. Thanks.

SOT · May 05, 2005, 07:07 AM // 07:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vynn

I recently sold a hammer for 25G - Blunt Damage was 7-11

Don't hate me either :P

I've had the same sword since level 8 and I love it. I am now 12

SOT · May 05, 2005, 07:08 AM // 07:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kingofblades

15-23 Damage sword? Swords only go to 22.. Check the pvp characters. Unless you are saying they giving pve characters an advantage for no reason? Go into the game and hit print screen then upload it to image shack or stop lying. Thanks.

Hell go lookup the stuff on this site HERE. You're wrong. End of sentence.

Xellos · May 05, 2005, 07:46 AM // 07:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by SOT

Hell go lookup the stuff on this site HERE. You're wrong. End of sentence.

I don't see where it states the swords are over 15-22.

ShaneFalco · May 05, 2005, 09:54 AM // 09:54

There are now 404 items on Ebay... Pretty sad seeing as how most of these items won't make anyone superpowerful.

Besides, I'd rather get my own items, and make my own cash.

Galatea · May 05, 2005, 10:01 PM // 22:01

ick.
did an ebay search for guild wars and now people are just selling GOLD already. it's about $30 for 10k -_-;;

Pevil Lihatuh · May 06, 2005, 11:42 AM // 11:42

well i just noticed the two links listed in this thread had NO bids.

Seems that no one (yet) is sad enough to buy the game AND the items in it. I have little problem with people wanting to buy it, i just find it incredibly pathetic. "oh im gonna spend £40 on a game but instead of then playing that game im gonna spend more money so i look uber-1337... but can't play for toffee" hehe if those people have so much money they can help me pay my stupidly extortionate rent! :P

Galatea · May 06, 2005, 03:47 PM // 15:47

that's not true.
six people have bid on a "Fiery Giant Slayer's Hammer of Defense" and it's at $10.50 already. -_-;; i saw another sword last night at around $26 or $29.

Last Gasp · May 06, 2005, 04:38 PM // 16:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by SSE4

Well for Guild Wars it is, indeed, pointless. However I think it's narrow-minded to think of it as totally bad. In Final Fantasy XI (When I played it) I played for months (Translating to around $60 in monthly fees) and I had to stop my adventuring every hour to go and try and get gil. On the other hand, someone could spend say, $50 for 1 million gil, and be set well into the mid-level range. That would save them the good $100 of monthly fees (And time spent) running around mining or doing other tedious tasks to get the gil they need to buy equipment. They can just "jump in and enjoy". Keep in mind, in my time playing, I did not make 1 million gil.

On the other hand, you don't need to pay for Guild Wars, so the entire system is just bent. There's no need to do anything like that, because everything can easily be attained in-game and they don't need to pay a monthly fee, stopping the idea of time = money.

Ask yourself this: Why was everything you needed on the AH so insanely expensive?

Answer: Ebay farmers driving up the prices. The special items in FF:XI sit on timed spawn mobs, that almost always show up in the same place, and so on a timed rotation: Nirvana for the professional farmer. So, you've 5 farmers waiting at the spot and maybe 1 person who actually wants to use it. Hardly anybody can get it themselves, so they have to pay the farmers' prices on the auction house.

Moral of the Story: FF:XI is a great example of why ebaying this stuff is bad, not a good example like you think.

There will be one thing in guild wars that sells really well: An account with all upgrades and one or more skillsets completely unlocked, especially if it has a ready made popular character class with the two 15 point quests already completed.

Pevil Lihatuh · May 06, 2005, 04:42 PM // 16:42

and it will happen. Check for Ultima Online. People who are finishing with that game are selling their accounts with 2 maxed out characters, over 1mil in gold, x amount of artifacts, full house, rares, veteran rewards etc... and people are moronic enough to buy them. *shrugs*

meh it's like people who cheat to look good. Let them do it, but they're only making themselves look stupid. It's people that learn how to play the game that look good.

Quest_techie · May 06, 2005, 09:14 PM // 21:14

it's easy, people just deflate the economy, a group gets together, floods a district with lowball prices, it spreads, granted people are greedy but they like to think that they are good, it'd take time but if people started now it'd be easier later

Bone_White_Haze · May 06, 2005, 09:53 PM // 21:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by TwinRaven

Don't get me wrong here, I mean, God bless capitalism, but trying to sell an in-game item for real cash is real low. Especially in this game...it won't do anyone any good, unless they want to look cool dying.

What's really sad it that before e-bay, giving away high end items in MMO's used to be a commonplace activity. Got your second-best sword hanging out in storage collecting dust? Find a newborn and make his day.

Somewhere along the way (probably with the appearance of EQ), that sense of community among gamers disappeared...and once it's gone, it'll never come back.